i think steve is spot on,when i first started last december the pain was unbelievable but i new that it would go in time if i just carried on despite the toothache pain lol,also for me i want to be as strong as these guys or stronger so i didnt care bout the pain,i knew i just had to get the first few months outa the way,but it did interfear wif my manuel job on quite a few occassions lol,maybe dont let new guys pull for more than 10 mins an arm to start wif they will thank you in the morning,but i think pain is alot of the reason why guys and gals quit